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Wales. He could see no reason why the do. Since the charges, amounting to Princess of Wales should be passed over 135,0001. had been taken off the civil list, with a comparatively inadequate provision. and that list had been very considerably He had heard the rumour, which he dared added to, he could not but think it more say was familiar to them all, of a separa- eligible to bear this burthen, than that it tion between the high parties in question, should be laid on the people. The 30,0001. but he knew nothing of this parliamenta in the act of the 18th of his Majesty did rily, and could only express his opinion, not seem necessary, so long as the Printhat the sum at present allotted to the cesses had their parents' house to reside in; Princess of Wales was, considering her si- and it was in this view that its provisions tuation, insufficient. She was the wife of were made-but now 36,0001. was pro. the Regent, and as much the representa- posed, with that conveniency still existing tive of the Queen as the Regent was the and likely to be taken advantage of. To representative of his Majesty. The sum a new grant, on this ground, he could see set apart for her was not enough to enable no good cause. There were different her to support the splendour of the cha- ways of acquiring popularity; and while racter in the way to which the nation were some men might make themselves obnoxi. entitled. But there was no splendourous, by pursuing the line of conduct he there were no drawing rooms or any ex- was now adopling, others might, by a pence of this kind now attached to the contrary course, he making themselves royal functions, and yet they were called acceptable to the higher powers. Few upon, and had augmented the revenues men in the habit of intercourse with those applicable to that purpose. Of the sepa. in a superior station, were able to resist ration to which he had alluded, every one the inclination of recomiending themspoke but the right hon, the Chancellor of selves by consulting the wishes of their the Exchequer, who knew more about it superiors; but how could this be reconthan they did he knew a great deal about ciled with a sense of public duty! As for it, he had acted as her Royal Highness's the splendour of royalty, he did not becounsel in the investigation which had lieve that the people of this country atbeen so much talked of, and if he so tached so much weight to that circunthought fit, might afford them information stance as the right hon. gentleman (Mr. on the subject. It would be better to Tierney) seemed to imagine. They were do this in an open manner, than to suffer more interested in questions involving his old client to be pared off with so scanty their constitutional liberties and rights. a subsistence-it would be better than to He was not for reducing the throne or its suffer these reports about his favourite appearance, where that appearance was Princess to be whispered about.-The right necessary for the good and credit of the hon. gentleman was once her Royal High nation; but he was averse to splendour, ness's loudest champion, and yet he now
unconnected with these objects. If they consented to allow the Prince Regent's looked to the affairs of Europe for the last wife to be passed over-in this way, at a time ten years, they would see that, in proporwhen he was proposing provisions so ample tion as the liberties of the several states to all the other female branches of the were diminished, the splendours of royalty royal family.
were increased. This comparison afforded Mr. William Smith observed, that the no very happy augury on the present ocpresent question included so much of a casion. It had been said that the trappersonal nature, that a member, standing pings of royalty were sufficient to mainforward on the occasion, was liable to be tain a republic. This he deemed to be an exposed to considerable obloquy. He had, absurd idea. His opinions were that all that in defiance of this risk, originally opposed tended to the real safety of the state ought the increased grant to the Princes, and to be kept up-that the generosity of the now felt it to be his duty to follow the public would amply provide for the exsame course with respect to the Princesses. pence attendant on this—and that it would He could see no sort of occasion, at a pe- be infinitely wiser, in the present situation riod when the burthens of the people were of the country, for the royal family and 80 great, and the pressure of the time was its advisers to remember the sacrifices so heavily felt by all-he could see no making by all classes to meet the exigenoccasion for imposing this new load upon cies and pressure of the times, and not to : them; so far from it, in his opinion, it allow the mere decorations of royalty to ought to be the last thing the House should add to their burthens and distress. One
great miscalculation appeared in this mat. He did not pretend to know what actual ter-What was given to the chief magis increase of expence had been incurred by trate ought not to be niggardly, because her Majesty for horses and carriages since the honour of the nation was implicated that period, but he knew there was no ap, in the manner in which he sustained his parent increase. A permanent increase rank. But here when, as his hon, friend of the civil list, to the amount of 70,0001, had stated, the expence had increased had afterwards been granted, under the while the splendour had diminished, he supposition that it would defray all the thought in time that parliament should charges of the former civil list, and that inquire before it extended that expence. the Princesses would derive the same sup
- He could not conclude without saying port from it, and continue to live with the something about the provision for her Queen. But it was said now, in support royal bighness the Princess of Wales. of the present motion, that possibly they He observed, in the charges upon the civil would not continue to live with their list, 58,000l. for a queen dowager, who royal mother. He called upon the right kept no court, and only 20,0001. for a hon. gentleman to reconcile the inconsisqueen who ought to keep a court; and tency of his different statements. He surely that was a division which did not called upon him to state, what reasons he exactly accord with the splendour of the bad to think that the Princesses would not throne. When he considered that, and continue to live as they had hitherto done. when he considered too that there had To the increase of the annuities, considering been two large grants made to two persons, the change of the times, he would not perwithout any of that splendour which such haps have a material objection; but the grants ought to produce, resulting from anticipation of those annuities was a questhem, he thought it infinitely better to tion widely different. The Princesses postpone the present vote.
might continue to live with the Queen ; Mr. Ponsonby would not think bimself his Majesty might still live many years, justified in voting for the motion, unless while the Princesses could enjoy the ansone additional reasons were adduced to nuities intended for them by former acts remove the objections he still had on his of parliament, only on the demise of their mind. He bad himself first objected to royal father. On these grounds, and the perplexed manner in which the right however willing he was, and should be at hon. gentleman had brought forward the all times, to contribute to the comforts and measures for the support of the royal fa- splendour of the royal family, he must mily in the present circumstances; he vote against the motion. bad repeatedly called for a clear and dis- Mr. Fremantle thought the proposed tinct account on that head, and was con measure was due to the Princesses, from vinced that the House could not in duty the situation in which they stood, and the proceed to grant further sums without hav- distinguished and amiable characters they ing first obtained such an account. The possessed. He certainly was of opinion, present motion was, besides, founded on that if the enquiry into the civil list was grounds utterly false; it went, not to ful- gone into, the charge might be provided fil the provisions of former acts, but to an- for without laying any additional burthen ticipate them, and to give the Princesses on the people, but in the mean time he the present enjoyment of those annuities, could not suspend his vote. His right which, under those acts, they could not hon. friend who had just spoken, had expect till after the demise of the King. asked upon what pretence the anticipation The additional grant of 10,000l. to her could be justified ? he would answer, on Majesty had been granted on representa- the situation in which the Princesses stood, tions equally fallacious, made by the on the wish they must feel to be relieved right hon. gentleman. What reasons did from the daily observation of domestic be submit to the House, to induce them calamity within the walls of the palace. 10 confer that additional 10,0001. a year The country was called upon, from a conupon her Majesty! Why, that it was sideration of their age and situation, to very likely her Majesty would wish to make the grant. He had lived in the change her residence, and would have to neighbourhood of the Princesses, had wit. incur increased expences, in consequence nessed their charily, and heard of the good of his Majesty's indisposition, whose equi- they did in the neighbourbood around pages, carriages, horses, &c. served for the them, and would consent most willingly general accommodation of the royal family. to afford them the means of continuing
their benefactions. He separated the The Chancellor of the Exchequer could not question entirely from that of the civil list, refrain from taking notice of the contraapd should give his vote in favour of it diction between the latter part of the bon. with the most heartfelt satisfaction. gentleman's speech and that which pre
Mr. D. Giddy said, in reply to what ceded it. The hon. gentleman concluded had faller from a right hon. gentleman, by saying, that he would not vote a shil. that, as chairman of the committee on the ling of the public money till corruption civil list cxpenditure, he should certainly and sinecure places were done away; and apply to the House for leave to examine yet in the former part of his speech be persons as well as consider documents, if had asked, why had not the 'Princess of it should be found necessary for the elucis Wales drawing-rooms like the Queen, and dation of the subject referred to the exami- the same state and splendour? The bon. nation of the committee.
gentleman should have been aware, howMr. Bennet conceived that the present ever, that if she was to have this addi. application 10 parliament for additional tional state and splendour, there must be sums to the royal family, while there an additional grant of money; and yet
so many indications of distress the hon. gentleman was not disposed to throughout almost every part of the coun- vole a shilling towards it. As to all the try, was exceedingly ill-timed. At any
At any questions which had been put to him on rate, when an application was made on ac- the subject of “the Delicate Investigacount of the Princesses, he hoped the tion," he should say nothing. The differight hon. gentleman opposite would give rence alluded to was certainly an unfortuthem some information, why no suitable nate circumstance; but neither as minisprovision was to be proposed for the Prin- ter, nor confidential adviser of his Royal cess of Wales, the wife of the Prince Re- Highness, did he feel himself called upon to gent. He asked the right hon. gentle. make any specific statement to the House man, because he was aware, that no one on the subject. With regard to the grant knew more of the subject than he did no of an additional 10,000l. to the Queen, it one was more in the secret of what was was certainly given entirely independent called “ the Delicate Investigation." Why of any consideration on account of the was she now, as wife of the Prince Regeni, Princesses. The grant was to cover the adnot to have the same state, the same draw- ditional expences to which her Majesty was ing-rooms, and the same splendour, as the likely to be put, in the present unfortunate wife of the King? What was there that situation of her royal husband, being dehad happened which made it improper prived of the assistance which she would that she should appear in the station of a otherwise bave derived from the royal estaqueen at a time that her husband per- blishment. In proposing it he had stated, formed the functions of royalty, and re. that, as it could not be the wish of the presented the person of the King? Every House absolutely to compel her Majesty body bad heard a good deal about books to reside constantly in the palace at Windthat were to have been published, and li. sor, it would be necessary to make an adbels that were suppressed; and they had ditional grant in order to allow her lo seen advertisements in the newspapers of change her residence if she thought profering large sums of money for suppressed per. With respect to the increase of the copies of these libellous books. Now civil list, as to which much bad been said, there certainly must be considerable in- it was to be borne in mind, that though formation in some quarter or other about there was an increase of expence to the these matters, and as the right hon. gentle country, yet :here was a diminution to the man had been long the confidential adviser Prince of Wales, when compared with and counsellor of her Royal Highness, he what was received by his father. It was hoped that he would not now desert bis undoubtedly true, that the maintenance of friend in her utmost need, but that be the two separate establishments of his Mawould state what was the reason for her jesty and the Prince of Wales, would rebeing so neglected and passed by upon quire a larger sum than what would have this occasion. As for himself, he did not sufficed for bis Majesty alone. When he feel disposed to vote another shilling until was upon the subject of the civil list, he the corrupt expenditure of the public mo- would state that he was sure what had ney was restrained, and the necessary re- been said by an hon. gentleman was a trenchments made, both as to sinecures mere inadvertency; but though the suband other branches of the public expence. ject was perfectly well understood in the House, it was not understood elsewhere ; | liament for a provision for the Princesses, for this bad frequently been made a subject and it did not seem to him, therefore, to of wilful misrepresentation; and it had be proper, that the subject should be postbeen contended that the whole of the civil poned till such an enquiry should be conlist was disposable by his Majesty at his cluded. At all events, he thought the pleasure. With regard to the increase of grant of what was necessary should be the civil list, on account of the Royal Fa- made now, and the savings which the mily, undoubtedly a family so large as committee should recommend might be her Majesty the Queen had been blessed made afterwards. with, did require a large sum from the na. Mr. Whitbread rose to defend the alleged tion; but it was unfair to consider the inconsistency in the speech of bis hon. 218,0001. appropriated for this purpose, as friend (Mr. Bennet) who opposed the adan addition to the civil list expenditure, dition to the expenditure of the Civil List, and to blend together in one list the ex. and yet thought that an addition ought to pences of the
younger branches of the fa- be made to the income of the Princess mily and the expences of the Prince of Regent. It appeared to him, that in this Wales. This was not a fair representa- there was no inconsistency; because his tion of the civil list. It was unfair to honourable friend and himself had no make any comparison between a civil list doubt, that if the expenditur with the addition of so numerous a family, perly looked into, such retrenchments and a civil list before that family was in might be made as would enable the Prinexistence. The present situation of his cess Regent to be put in a situation to Majesty naturally brought the present maintain such a splendour, as was suitable provision to the Princesses before the to her high rank in this country. Surely House. They were now equally, as in in this there was no inconsistency; and it the case of his demise, deprived of the was a fearful thing, and a just cause of countenance and protection of their sove- alarm to the country, that notwithstandreigo and their father. . It was no doubt ing all the grants which they had so lately true, as had been stated by the right hon. made to the Prince Regent, if that bappy gentleman, that the Princesses would be restoration took place, an event which enabled to live with more splendour if every person in the country most anxiousthey lived together ; but the House would ly looked to, the right hon. gentleman surely not eke and measure out their would still come down to the House with bounty to them in such a way as to com. fresh demands on the people. The right pel them to live together. It was highly hon. gentleman had told the House, that probable, however, that they would con- neither' as servant of the crown, nor as tinue to live as they had bitherto done. adviser of his Royal Highness, would he Such would undoubtedly be their wish, as say any thing on this subject; but the it must be the wish of every body else. time was, when the right hon. gentleman The right hon. gentleman again (Mr. Pon- had not only said much on the subject, but sonby) thought that nothing whatever had taken such measures as would have ought to be done on the present occasion; enabled all his Majesty's subjects to underthat the grant to the Princesses ought to stand it. It was well known, that a book be in a contingent situation so long as his had been prepared by the right hon. genMajesty should continue in existence, and tleman for publication ; that out of some that the Princesses, at whatever period of fund, whether public or private he could life they might be arrived, should always not tell, the expence of the printing of this be necessarily resident in the house of the book was defrayed ; that measures were King and Queen. When the House, how. taken that not only the subjects of this ever, came to take into their consideration kingdom, but all the continent of Europe, the situation of these persons, their time should be made acquainted with it, but of life, and the amiable character they that suddenly the book had been suppresshad always maintained, he did not believe ed, and the outstanding copies bought up they would be inclined to deal with them at an enormous price, proceeding from in so hard a manner. It appeared to him, what quarter he knew not. It appeared to that there could indeed be no reasonable bim, therefore, that as counsel for her royal expectation that the result of any inqui- highness the Princess Regent formerly, ries made by committees of that House, and as the present adviser of the Prince would point out any savings sufficient to Regent, the right hon. gentleman was supersede the necessity of coming to par- placed in a situation which above all others
made it necessary for him to speak out on of that splendour and dignity which was the present occasion. He could not con- supposed to become the royal station, and ceive that the right hon. gentleman would for the benefit of the nation. It had, hownow feel an inclination to be mute, when ever, been complained of by many, that 80 recently he was disposed to have ten with increasing grants, we bad diminished thousand tongues. For his part he would splendour, While the King enjoyed his say, that not only was there no proportion health, he always kept up a court. He between the sums of 58,0001. appropriated used to have two levees and a drawingto the Queen, and the allowance io her room in the week, which gave his subroyal highness the Princess Regent, but jects, and particularly those who had peconsidering also, that this was not the litions to present, sufficient access to his sole allowance to the Queen, and that pro- throne. Now these levees were very rare vision was also made for her at the royal indeed ; and subjects had had hitherto
l; table and otherwise, the different situation less access to the throne than when the of the Princess of Wales, whom the public King was in health. In the course of only knew to be living in retirement, the present year only one court had been sometimes at Blackheath, and sometimes held. There was another point on which at Kensington, could not fail to strike every he wished for explanation : 70,000l. per person in the community. All that the annum had been granted as payment of public knew of her Royal Highness was, certain debts which ought never to have that she was not in the situation in which been named in that House, as having been she ought to be ; although the right hon. contracted in defiance of, and in the very gentleman had written a book in her fa- teeth of an act of parliament. He would vour. They knew moreover that if ever wish to know how long that 70,000l. anshe were to be put on a footing corres- nually was to be paid, or, when those ponding to her rank, they would be called debts of which parliament knew nothing upon for a fresh grant of money. The should be satisfied, to wbat uses this sum right hon. gentleman had told them, that would be applied ? the enquiry could be carried on as well Mr Ponsonby felt himself called upon, after the present grant as before it. But to reply to something which had fallen it was very well known that the right hon. from the right bon. gentleman opposite. gentleman was very skilful when it suited He was, however, in part anticipated in his purpose, so to assort and regulate the what he wished to observe by his bon. documents produced by him, as to give friend, who had just sat down; because in that length to any enquiry which he his opinion, nothing was so unfair as to thought proper. If the grant however throw any thing like an odium on those were made dependent on the enquiry, the who opposed such a measure as the precommittee on the Civil List would not have sent, by inferring that they entertained an the same long and unsatisfactory papers as inadequate opinion of the merits and chathey now had laid before them; and the racters of those, who were the objects of chairman of the committee would soon the bounty of the House. The merit of find that many living witnesses would be the Princesses made no part of the object speedily brought forward to remove every of consideration of the House, otherwise, doubt or obstruction. He therefore con- this grant would have been made many ceived that when he opposed the resolu. years ago; because they did not come tion he was acting in consistency with into all the good qualities which they were his former vote for postponing the commit- in possession of, since the commencement tee for a month.
of bis Majesty's unfortunate malady. Mr. Wynn thought it very unfair to rest They were amiable before this period; the present question upon the merits and but this was no part of the consideration the virtues of the Princesses, who were the of the case. The question was merely immediate subjects of the present discus- whether parliament ought to anticipate sion. This was invidious, as it threw a the period when they were engaged to kind of odium on those who might oppose make provision for the Princesses : The the grant, as if they were not as ready as grounds which the House ought to consiothers to acknowledge those merits and der, were, whether the Princesses were those virtues. The liberal grants, however, likely to be put into a situation speedily which parliament had formerly voted for to incur greater expences than their prethe royal family, were not intended merely sent income could afford? But on this for their support, but for the support also subject, the right hon. gentleman had no