and I am confident that this house will be no | is by the choice of the people. I think it not more ashamed of their actions than the last natural, nor rational, that the people, who sent was. Printing our Votes will be for the ho- us hither, should not be informed of our acnour of the king, and safety of the nation. I tions. In the Long Parliament it was a trade am confident, if it had been necessary, you amongst clerks to write Votes, and it was then would have had petitions from the parts I said, by a learned gentleman, That it was no come from, that your actions might be made offence to inform the people of Votes of parlipublic. As I came hither, every body almost ament, &c. and they ought to have notice of that I met upon the road cried, God bless them.' The Long Parliament were wise in you! I move, therefore, That your Votes their generation to conceal many things they may be ordered to be printed, with the rest of did from the people; and the clerk, who disyour proceedings.' And I shall only add, that persed the Votes, was sent away, and nothing yourself has done so well in taking that care done to him. The Popish party dread nothing upon you the last parliament, that the house more than printing what you do, and I dread will desire you to continue them in the same that a man in Jenkins's post, (and such an acmethod. cusation upon him, as is in the last parliament) should hold such a position, that printing your Votes was an Appeal to the People.' Resolved, "That the Votes and Proceedings of this house be printed." Sir Wm. Cowper. That which put me upon moving the printing your Votes, the last parliament, was false papers that went about, in former parliaments, of the votes and transactions of the house. Let men think what they please, the weight of England is the people, and the world will find, that they will sink Popery at last. Therefore I second the motion. Mr. Sec. Jenkins. I beg pardon, if I consent not to the motion. Consider the gravity of this assembly; there is no great assembly in Christendom that does it. It is against the gravity of this assembly, and it is a sort of Appeal to the People. It is against your gravity, and I am against it. Mr. Boscawen. If you had been a privycouncil, then it were fit what you do should be kept secret; but your Journal-Books are open, and copies of your Votes in every coffee-house, and if you print them not, half votes will be dispersed, to your prejudice. This printing is like plain Englishmen, who are not ashamed of what they do, and the people you represent will have a true account of what you do. You may prevent publishing what parts of your transactions you will, and print the rest. Mr. L. Gower. I find that those who write our votes and transactions, and send them all England over, are favoured, and I believe that no gentleman in the house will be against printing them, but Jenkins. I hope you will not be ashamed of what you do; therefore I am for printing your votes, Colonel Mildmay. By experience we have found, that, when former parliaments have been prorogued or dissolved, they have been sent away with a Declaration against them. If our actions be naught, let the world judge of them; if they be good, let them have their virtue. It is fit that all Christendom should have notice of what you do, and posterity of what you have done; and I hope they will do as you do; therefore I am for printing the votes. 6 Mr. Harbord. Now you have passed this Vote, I would graft something upon it. I move, That the care of printing the Votes may be committed to the Speaker,' who so well acquitted himself in it the last parliament. -Which was ordered. Debate on the Miscarriage of the Bill for Repeal of 35th Eliz.] Mr. Hopkins made a motion to enquire why the Bill of Repeal of a Statute of 35th Eliz. which, in the last parliament, had passed both houses, was not presented with the rest for the royal assent. Mr. Hampden. I think the motion is to enquire after the slipping of that Act the last parliament, and not presenting it for the royal assent. For my own part, I look upon it as a breach of the constitution of the government. We are told that we are republicans, and would change the government: but such as are about to do so, it is a natural fear in them to be thought so, and they will cast it upon others. In a crowd, it is frequent for pickpockets to cry out, Gentlemen, have a care of your pockets,' that they may be more safe themselves, and have the less suspicion upon them. I will not offer this to your considertion to-day, but move you to adjourn it till tomorrow. Sir F. Winnington. I shall humbly put in this word. I doubt this matter will be too big for to-day; it is of great importance, and will not be forgotten. Be pleased to adjourn the debate of it.-Which was accordingly done. Debate on bringing in the Bill of Exclusion.] Sir Nich. Carew. I move, That for the preservation of the Protestant Religion, and the king's Person, a Bill be brought in to prevent a Popish Successor, and in particular against James duke of York, the same Bill which passed the last parliament. Sir Francis Winnington. Because what has Mr. Sec. Jenkins. I must give my negative been said by Jenkins is a single opinion, for he to this motion; and my reason why I do so, says, printing is an Appeal to the People,' I is, because the king has declared, in his Speech, hope the house will take notice that printingThat, as to the point of the Succession, he our Votes is not contrary to law. But pray will not depart from what he has so often dewho sent us hither? The privy council is con-clared.' The king has given his vote against stituted by the king, but the house of commons it; and therefore I must do so too. Mr. L. Gower. The duke of York is in Scotland, and I hope the king will now come up to what he has said in his Speech. My liberty and property are dear to me, and I will support the king's prerogative too; and those people that are briars and thorns scratch you in your intentions against Popery; which, I see, we cannot prevent without this Bill. Col. Birch. I am heartily glad to find that the zeal of the house still continues for the Protestant religion. My opinion is, that we cannot preserve the Protestant religion with a Popish successor to the crown, any more than water can be kept cold in a hot pot. But I would do it in all the decent ways to come at it. The king recommends to you, in his Speech, to look back to what he formerly said as to the Succession, &c.' If there be no other way to prevent Popery, my opinion is, that it will be more decent to our prince, and better for those who sent us hither, before the Bill be brought in, to give it the honour of a day, to consider of Expedients to save Religion, &c. for that I shall expect from some honourable persons; if none come, then you may proceed to this Bill with more honour; therefore appoint a day for consideration. Sir John Ernly. I should not have troubled you but from what was spoken last. By all means just and lawful, we are to secure our religion and properties; we see the great attempts made upon us from Rome, and we must do something for our farther security. I will not speak of the former Bill against the duke, nor of the king's Speech; that give you latitude for Expedients, and I would not offer any if I thought they would not do as well as that Bill, | which is but an Expedient; but because the king has declared against that Bill, and invited you to Expedients, I would not put that Bill any more to the hazard of rejection, but think of some Expedients. Mr. Harbord. I can see no expedient to save religion, and preserve the king's person, but the Bill to exclude the duke, &c. All gentlemen, I believe, would be willing as to the manner, and save the matter, but when our prince is encompassed with all the duke's creatures, the duke's safety is because of their dependencies. The danger is not from Popery, but from the king's being encompassed with the duke's creatures. I would proceed in this matter with all decency; and since a day is moved for, pray let us have time to consider. Sir Christ. Musgrave. You are invited, by the king's gracious motion, to consider how to preserve Religion, &c. I desire that we may not now put a question for bringing in a Bill to exclude the duke, else properly we cannot consider any expedients for preservation of Religion. Mr. Whorwood. They who advised the king's Speech, must answer for it. I think those about the king have done enough to ruin bin and us. But I would have the king see, that we are so far from putting him upon that stress, that we would help him out. I think that Speech, which the king did read to us, had nothing of the king's in it. He is a better man, and a better protestant, than to do it of himself; therefore I would not put on a Resolution, here, as flat and as short as the king's Speech. The king has gone as far as this Resolution comes to, in his Declaration about Dissenters formerly, and yet he was persuaded to revoke it. If persons have been so prevalent about the king, as to put the king upon this Speech, let me see those persons so forward to bring the king into a thing, to help him out; if they do not, I hope the king will lay the blame at their doors, and not at ours. If they could have told us what Expedients were necessary, they would have put them into the king's Speech, and the resolution-part, of not altering the Succession,' would have been left out. A little consideration, in this great matter, can do us no hurt, and will satisfy the people without doors. But if they about the king can find no Expedients, I hope he will lay them aside, and take their counsel no more. Mr. Powle. Though I hear of Expedients abroad, yet I cannot conceive that a title or name can destroy the nature of expedients. But the king, in his speech, has held you out a handle, &c. and I would not give those about the king occasion to say, that this house is running into a breach with him. Mr. Hampden. This is a matter of great weight, and I would adjourn it till to-morrow. As for the reason of proposing Expedients, I do not move to adjourn for that, for it is as little reason to me to expect any as it was the last parliament. That parliament gave reasons why no Expedients could be of any effect but this Bill of Exclusion, and that parliament saw enough of Expedients. There are a great many talked of abroad in the streets, and will not you hear Expedients? What can a man say less, with any modesty? But no man can say but that we are in danger, if the duke should come to the crown. But the question is, Whether you will put off this debate? Therefore I move, That the house will take into consideration the security of the Protestant Religion to-morrow.' Sir Fr. Winnington. When this Bill passed the last parliament, it was nem. con, and most of this parliament were of the last. As for Expedient,' it is a word mightily used, and talked of, and willingly embraced; but none have been proposed. Let this matter be re-assumed on Saturday, and so taken into consideration, to secure the Protestant Religion, and not to let any thing appear upon your Books, relating to Expedients, or preventing a Popish Successor. Mr. Trenchard. I was much surprized at the king's Speech, considering your weighty reasons for the Bill, &c. the last parliament, and that the lords found no Expedients effectual for preservation of Religion; but that the king may see that what we do is out of a real sense of the danger we are in, &c. and not in contradiction to him, and when nothing is found effectual to save us, that we may justify ourselves in what we do, therefore I am for adjourning the debate. Resolved, nem. con. That this house will, on Saturday the 26th, consider of means for the security of the Protestant Religion, and for the safety of the king's Person.' Thanks voted to Counties and Boroughs, for electing their Members without Charge.] March 25. Mr. Swynfin. When there has been a general corruption, and all have not done their duty, you should distinguish and give Thanks to them that have. As you have done to officers for doing their duty in suppression of Popery, when through the corruption of the times, some have not done their duty. Nothing is more parliamentary than to return thanks to those who have freely, and without expence, chosen you Members, and I desire that these Members so elected should send their Thanks to those who chose them, Which was ordered accordingly as follows: "It being represented to this house by several members, That many counties, cities, and boroughs, have freely, without Charge, elected many of the Members in this present parlia ment, according to the ancient constitution of elections of members to serve in parliament; wherefore this house doth give their Thanks to such counties, cities, and boroughs, for the said elections." out to frustrate bills. The king cannot take Mr. Garroway. I was a friend to this bill, Sir Rob. Howard. I would have you search the lords Journals, and if you find no account of the bill there, then it will be time for us to go to the lords. Sir Rd. Temple. I fully concur in the weight and consequence of this matter, and you are to take all the care that can be to secure it for the future. Never any thing of this nature was done before, but the Bill for the better observation of the Sabbath, in the late Long Parliament; it was left upon the table, at a conference, and stolen away. (see p. 285) It is not proper to take notice of this in a Message to the lords, because the miscarriage of this bill was in another parliament. The matter must go upon the desire of a conference, concerning the rights and privileges of both houses of parliament, and then you may appoint a committee to inform you of the progress of this matter. Mr. Vaughan. I think the passing over the enquiry after the loss of the Bill of the Sabbath was the great occasion of the loss of this. Consider how many interruptions parliaments have had, of late, in the greatest business, by prorogations and dissolutions; and another way to gratify your enemies is to stifle your laws when they have a mind the people should have no benefit of them, though they have passed both houses. Farther Debate on the Loss of the Bill for Repeal of a Statute of 35 Eliz.] Sir Wm. Jones. This matter deserves material consideration, whether in respect of the loss of the Bill, or the shaking the very constitution of parliament. The bill that is lost, is of great moment, and of great use to secure the country, and perhaps their lives too, in the time of a Popish Successor. Those men that hindered the passing that bill had a prospect of that, and if it be sent up again, we are like to meet with great opposition. But be the bill what it will, the precedent is of the highest consequence. The king has his negative to all bills, but I never knew that the clerk of the parliament had a negative, if he laid it aside, or not. But consider, if we send up many good bills, if this be not searched into, we may be deprived of them. No man that knows law or history but can tell, that to bills grateful and popular the king gives his consent; but if this way be found out, that bills shall be thrown by, it may be hereafter said they were forgotten and laid by, and so we shall never know whether the king would pass them, or not. If this be suffered, it is vain to spend time here, and it will be a great matter to find time to redress it. I move, therefore, That a Message Col. Titus. In things of this nature, it is the be sent to the lords, for a conference, that best way to observe old methods, and the best some way may be found out to give us satisfac-method to know one another's mind is by contion in this great matter.' Mr. Boscawen. I do concur with Jones, that parliaments are prorogued and dissolved by the king, and now here is a new way found Sir Henry Capel. The lords are the depositaries of all Bills, but those of Money; and without any other words, I would send for a conference, to know what is become of the Bill. I know of but three negatives to bills, but by this, there is a fourth; which will destroy the government. ference. I remember, the lords once sent to falling and dangerous,' but they sent for a conference on a matter of great consequence;' therefore I would send to the lords for conference about matters relating to the nation.' Mr. Hampden. I would say this in the Message; That we desire a conference with their lordships concerning the Constitution of parliaments in matter of passing Bills.' Resolved, "That a Message be sent to the lords, desiring a conference with their lordships in matters relating to the Constitution of parliaments in passing of Bills:" and a committee was appointed to prepare the subject-matter. Debate on Fitzharris's Examination.] Sir Wm. Waller gave an account of the discovery of Fitzharris's Plot; and sir George Treby read bis Examination.* Sir J. Hartop moves it may be printed, for the world to see the devilish conspiracies of the Papists. "A few days before the king went to Oxford, Fitzharris, an Irish Papist, was taken up for framing a malicious and treasonable Libel against the king and his whole family. He had met with one Everard, who pretended to make discoveries, and, as was thought, had mixed a great deal of falshood with some truth; but he held himself in general terms, and did not descend to so many particulars as the witnesses had done. Fitzharris and he had been acquainted in France; so on that confidence he showed him his Libel; and he made an appointment to come to Everard's chamber, who thought he intended to trepan him, and so had placed witnesses to overhear all that passed. Fitzharris left the Libel with him, all writ in his own hand. Everard went with the paper, and with his witnesses, and informed against Fitzharris, who upon that was committed. But seeing the proof against him was like to be full, he said, the Libel was drawn by Everard, and only copied by himself.' But he had no sort of proof to support this. Cornish, the sheriff, going to see him, he desired he would bring him a justice of the peace; for he could make a great discovery of the Plot, far beyond all that was ever known. Cornish, in the simplicity of his heart, went and acquainted the king with this: for which he was much blamed; for it was said, by this means that discovery might have been stopped. But his going first with it to the court proved afterwards a great happiness both to himself and to many others. The secretaries and some privy-counsellors were, upon that, sent to examine Fitzbarris; to whom he gave a long relation of a practice to kill the king, in which the duke was concerned, with many other particulars which need not be mentioned; for it was all a fiction. The secretaries came to him a second time to examine him farther: he boldly stood to all that he had said; and desired that some justices of the city might be brought to him. So Clayton and Treby went to him; and he made the same pretended discovery to them over again; and insinuated, that he was glad it was VOL. IV. Sir Wm. Jones. I like the motion well for printing Fitzharris's Examination. Mr. Sec. Jenkins. The scandalous Paper reflecting upon the king was read over to his maj. by Waller; whereupon I issued out warrants to apprehend Fitzharri3, &c. and Waller saw the execution of them. Sir Fr. Winnington. This is of great impor tauce, and in it we ought to acquit ourselves like wise men. We, that come out of the country, hear that the treasonable Paper should have been sent to many gentlemen, and then they should have been seized upon as traitors in the conspiracy in this Plot. All is now at stake; therefore how long or short a time we are to sit here, (the trooper, Harrison, that was seized, said, 'We should have other guards at Oxford, than we had at Westminster,') let not our courage lessen. This being our case, let us go to the bottom of this business. It has been moved, That he should be sent for hither;' but we have experience, that, when once an accusation in parliament is against a man upon record, and in the greatest court in the kingdom made known, malefactors have not been cleared, and have not had justice; therefore I move, That you will take care that this man be impeached of High-Treason,' and, it may be, then he will tell you all. Sir Rob. Clayton. When Mr. Recorder and myself examined Fitzharris in Newgate, he asked us, Whether he had said enough to save his life? We told him, 'We thought not; but if he would ingenuously confess what counsel he had for drawing and modelling his treasonable Paper, and be ingenuous in the whole, we would take his farther Examination; and wished him to consider of it. But, the next day after he promised he would, he was removed out of our reach to the Tower. Fitzharris impeached.] Resolved, “That Edw. Fitzharris be impeached of High-Treason, in the name of all the commons of England; and that Mr. Secretary Jenkins do, to-inorrow morning, go up, and impeach him at the bar of the lords house." Debate on Mr. Sec. Jenkins refusing to carry up Fitzharris's Impeachment.] Mr. Sec. Jenkins. The sending me up with this Impeachment reflects upon his majesty, my master, in the character I bear under him; and I now in safe hands that would not stifle it. The king was highly offended with this, since it plainly showed a distrust of his ministers; and so Fitzharris was removed to the Tower; which the court resolved to make the prison for all offenders, till there should be sheriffs chosen more at the king's devotion. Yet the deposi tion made to Clayton and Treby was in all points the same that he had made to the Secretaries: so that there was uo colour for the pretence afterwards put on this, as if they had practised on him." Burnet. The Libel was entitled "The True Englishman, speaking plain English." It will be found in the Appendix No. XIII. 4 P will not go on the Message.-A great cry, 'To the Bar, To the Bar.' Sir Tho. Lee. I would not have said one word, but that the very being of the parliament is in the case. It is to no end to sit here any longer, if this be suffered. Jenkins had no ground or reason to bring the king's name in question, nor was there any reflection upon his majesty, or Jenkins, in sending him with the Impeachment. But, for Jenkins to say, 'Do what you will with me, I will not go with the Message! Let his words be first asserted, and read to you, before he explain them, according to the order of the house. Sir Geo. Hungerford. I never heard such words uttered in parliament before, That the whole house of commons should reflect upon the king in sending him with the Message,' and that he will not obey your commands.' Pray call him to the bar. At which there was a loud cry, To the Bar.' Mr. Trenchard. The house will grow contemptible to the extremest degree, at this rate. Such a thing was never before in parliament, that the whole house should reflect upon the king,' and for him to say, Do what you will with me, I will not go.' Mr. Sec. Jenkins. I said no such thing, That the house reflected on the king,' but That I take it as a reflection upon the king, my master.' His words were thus stated,This Message had not been put upon me but for the character I bear. I value not my life nor liberty; do what you will with me, I will not go.' Mr. Sec. Jenkins. I said That this is put upon me, to my apprehension, for the character I bear; and do what you will with me, I will not go.' Sir Wm. Jones. I am sorry to see any member behave himself at this rate. This confirms me in the opinion of the design some men have to depress the honour of this house. A Book has been written by a member of this bouse* (which, in time, I hope, you will consider of) That the house of commons, in Hen. iii's time, sprung out of Rebellion.' This goes on this day in the same method. Let a man be of what quality he will, if he be too big to carry your Message, he is too big to be your member, and not fit to be chosen for one. Thus to scorn the commands of the house, and to be too big for a messenger of the house of commons! Secretaries are sent on Messages every day, and is he too big for this, to accuse a person of the Popish Plot? If this be so, sit no longer here, but go home. His character is great, but he may be privy to things hid from us, possibly, by this extraordinary carriage. Is it come to that pass, for us to be dealt withal as none of our predecessors ever were before. If my brother, or son, dealt with the house thus, I would have him made an example; and, for aught I see, he provokes you more by his explanation; therefore pray go on. Mr. Sec. Jenkins. I am ready, and I think myself as much obliged as any man, to obey the commands of the house. The office I have under his maj. excludes me not; but the thing I stand upon is, that the motion was carried on in ridicule. I have an honour for this, and ever have had for all houses of commons, but in this Message I must and will be excused. Sir Hen. Capel. Ridicule is not a word proper for a house of commons: what is appointed by them is with all gravity, especially where the life of a man is concerned, as it is in an Impeachment. We are in au unfortunate age; now things come to light, more than we were before; that now it must be said, 'Impeachments of treason strike at the king,' and the Bill of excluding the duke, &c. is levelled at the king,' I am sorry it is said here, as well as in other places. This that we put upon Jenkins is an employment for the king's service, and he tells us, 'It reflects upon the king, and he will not go." All the commons do will be reversed, if this must pass for doctrine, That what we do reflects upon the king.' But, sir, we are in a ship, and we have to do with the master, and he with us. If this gentleman would make any sort of excuse for himself, I would, for my share, pass it by; but he has not taken it off, but rather aggravated it. If he has nothing farther to say for himself, he must withdraw, and then I shall make a motion, for the honour of the house. Sir Tho. Meres. I know no difference of any persons here; if Jenkins said, 'I thought sending me with the Impeachment reflected on the king; and in case it be so, I will suffer any thing under that reflection,' a man may be mistaken in his thoughts: But, as I take it, he said, 'It was his thoughts that the Message was a reflection upon the king, and in that case he would suffer any thing rather than a reflection upon the king in the character he bears.' Sir John Ernly, (after he had inspired Jenkins with a whisper, said,) It is an ill thing to stumble at the entrance. I do hope that Jenkins intended no disservice to the house, in what he said, but on a perfect mistake. I did apprehend, and so did some others, that he was put upon it, by the gentleman that moved it, in jest (Mr. Coningsby.) But be it in jest, or in earnest, he ought to obey your order; but every man cannot subdue his own heart. But I would know of Jenkins, whether, upon farther consideration, he will undertake this service, or no? I am the worst advocate in the world for an obstinate person; but I humbly offer it to your consideration to put the gentleman upon it, whether he will go, or no, before he withdraw. Mr. Sec. Jenkins. Since the house is so favourable as to hear me, I must say I did appre hend it a reflection upon the king, which was the reason why I refused the Message: but if I apprehend it a reflection upon the king my master, I am heartily sorry I should incur the Dr. Brady, who served for the University displeasure of the house, and I hope you will of Cambridge. pardon the freedom of the expression, of reflec |