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to make to the hon. gentleman who had just spoken, and to receive his advice with respect to them.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer expressed his perfect readiness to state in the House whatever he might have stated elsewhere on the subject; and which had been so stated by him only in the course of the conversations which he had held for the purpose of ascertaining, whether it would be more expedient for the public

the present and the next year, or only a smaller one to cover the necessities of the present year; as also, whether it would be expedient to take the sinking fund, or any part of it, for the same service.

Mr. Barnett observed, that in his opinion, if the right hon. gentleman had declared to the individuals in question, his intention to abstain from touching the sinking fund, the House ought to interfere to prevent the conclusion of a negotiation on such an understanding.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer replied that he had already said he had made no stipulation with respect to the sinking fund, which was of a binding or conclusive

nature.

Mr. Grenfell expressed his regret to find, that the right hon. gentleman had really done that which he before believed was attributed to him only by calumny. The right hon. gentleman had allowed, that he had made a communication of his finan-service to raise a large loan, sufficient for cial plan. But were loan-contractors the persons whom the right hon. gentleman ought to consult on such subjects? He was now compelled to believe the rumour that the right hon. gentleman had com. municated to certain persons, his inten. tion of raising a loan of 30 millions: and from what the right hon. gentleman had said, or rather from what the right hon. gentleman had abstained from saying, he believed another rumour, namely, that the right hon. gentleman had declared to the same persons, that he did not mean to ap ply any part of the sinking fund to the service of the current year. The right hon. gentleman had merely said, that the power of so applying the sinking fund was one of the means which the Treasury posLord Milton censured the course which sessed of preventing any combination or had been adopted by the right hon. genattempt at combination on the part of the tleman, and which would deprive the monied interest, and to the disadvantage public of the benefit to be derived from of the public. But what he (Mr. Gren- a competition for the loan. The right hon. fell) wanted was, not that it should be so gentleman had admitted, that he had held in terrorem; but, that it should be made a communication to some persons actually used, and the apprehended com- respecting his intentions; for as to the bination be thereby prevented. If the assertion of the right hon. gentleman, sinking fund were rendered available to that he had merely asked them questions the service of the year, the loan contrac- with regard to the expediency of various tors would not be driven to unite in fur-financial plans, it was not difficult to con. nishing what might be further required. What single contractor could grapple with such a loan as 30 millions? But if it were reduced to 15 millions, there would be two, three, or four competitors. He repeated, that the communication which had been made to the individuals in question was giving them a decided and an unfair advantage over all the rest of the monied interest in the city. The right hon. gentleman had almost tacitly acknowledged that he had done this. Was he even now prepared to give to the House and to the public the information which he had communicated to the loan-contractors? He was sorry to find that he had entertained a more favourable opinion of the right hon. gentleman than he appeared to be entitled to: but he was now completely satisfied that all the rumours which were afloat that very morning were but too well founded. '

ceive, that a chancellor of the exchequer might ask such questions in a way which would be very clearly indicative of his own purposes.

The Chancellor of the Exchequer repeated, that he had merely made inquiries to ascertain what plan promised to be the most efficient.

Mr. Grenfell observed, that if the right hon. gentleman had put his questions only to obtain information, he would not have been culpable; but if he had communicated his own opinion to the loan contractors, he had not discharged his duty. He ri diculed the idea of asking those persons whether it would be expedient to contract for a large or a small loan. Experience had sufficiently shown, that in such cases they had always declared una voce for the former.

The resolution was then agreed to,as were also the following: 2. "That 3,000,000l.

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be granted to his majesty to pay off exchequer bills issued pursuant to act 48 Geo. 3, c. 3, continued by an act of the 55th Geo. 3, c. 16, and further continued by an act of 56th Geo. 3, c. 7, intituled, An Act to continue until the 5th day of April 1818, and amend an act of the 48th year of his present majesty, for empowering the governor and com'pany of the Bank of England to advance the sum of three millions towards the supply for the service of the year 1808,' outstanding and unprovided for. 3. That 1,570,000, be granted to his majesty, for discharging interest on exchequer bills, Irish treasury bills, and Mint notes. 4. That 430,000l. being the one hundredth part of 43,000,000l. of exchequer bills, authorised in the last session of parliament to be issued and charged upon the aids granted in the present session, be granted to his majesty to be issued and paid by equal quarterly payments to the governor and company of the Bank of England, to be by them placed to the account of the commissioners for the reduction of the national debt, for the year ending the 1st day of February 1819. 5. That 4,400,000l. be granted to his majesty to pay off and discharge treasury bills, issued for the service of Ireland pursuant to acts 57 Geo. 3, c. 81, and 58 Geo. 3, c. 87, outstanding and unprovided for on the 5th day of January 1819, in British currency."

COURT OF CHANCERY IN IRELAND.] Mr. C. Grant observed, that in bringing in a bill to regulate the Fees in the Court of Chancery in Ireland, he had to claim the indulgence of the House, as this was a matter of great importance to the sister country. Some years since commissioners were appointed to inquire into the fees paid in the courts of chancery and exchequer in Ireland; those fees had long been a matter of complaint, and were carried so far as, in many instances, to impede the ends of justice. On inquiry, it was found that a scale of fees had existed in 1734, and had been acted upon up to 1767. Since that period the expenses had greatly increased, in some instances so much as 50 per cent. The right hon. member proceeded to state instances of the abuses found to exist. One was, that of charging the stamp duty on a sheet containing 72 words, instead of 90 as was formerly done. The next was fictitious attendances. A master in chancery had the power of

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issuing summonses to bring parties before him in taxing costs, but the fourth summons only was compulsory. By constructive attendances, however, the party was charged with the fees of the three first summonses, as if he had been examined each time; and not only was there a charge by the master in chancery for each constructive attendance, but also by the solicitor and six clerks; so that the party had in fact to pay three sets of fees for three several attendances which had never taken place. In one case a six clerk had made a charge of 1297 constructive attendances. He did not mean to cast imputation on the masters in chancery, but he thought no officer should be allowed to regulate the fees in which he was himself a participator. There were two remedies which might be applied to this evil-one was by the orders of the Court, and the other by an act of the legislature. The lord chancellor and the master of the rolls agreed with the commissioners in the principle of their report, but they differed as to the remedy to be applied. The commissioners advised that the taxing bills of costs should be removed altogether from the masters in chancery, and vested in two officers appointed for the purpose with fixed salaries, but without any profits arising from their office. The lord chancellor and the master of the rolls advised that the masters should still continue to tax bills of cost, but with a fixed salary for this particular duty; instead of the fees which they now receive. The only question for the House was, which of those plans was the better calculated to remedy the grievance allowed on all hands to exist. The comissioners were entitled to the attention of parliament, and so were the opinions of the law officers immediately connected with this court. By the bill he was about to introduce, the recommendation of the latter was adopted. One object of the bill was, to compel those words which can be expressed by figures to be so written, and not allow them to be spun out for the purpose of increasing the number of sheets. Another was, to make a sheet consist of 90 instead of 72 words. The present mode of examining witnesses was, by commissioners, two being appointed by each party. Those commissioners, who were generally solicitors, generally managed to have a number of examinations to make in the same place, which, however, did not lessen the expenses of their clients.

His bill vested in the lord chancellor the, power of appointing twelve barristers to act as commissioners on such occasions, at a fixed rate of charge. It might be urged, that this bill would go to injure the gentlemen who now derived profit from those fees, and who accepted, or perhaps purchased, their situations under the impression of such fees being continued. His intention was, to propose, that the parties should have a compensation for the difference between the salary to be given for the discharge of this duty, and the sums to which they would be entitled by the existing regulation. Here the hon. member quoted the opinions of lord Hardwicke and Mr. Justice Willes in support of this part of the bill. The amount of this compensation might be regulated on ascertaining what the business done by the masters or tax clerk, would produce, if the existing regulations were still in force. The commissioners were of opinion, that a moderate stamp duty on bills of costs would make good this compensation. He proposed that the salaries of the masters in chancery should be 800l. a year each, which would make no more in the whole than 3,200l. a year. The additional expense on the bills of cost would be freely paid by the parties when they found themselves relieved from the much greater charge of the present system. He was the more anxious to press this, in order to show those connected with the administration of justice in Ireland, that the eyes of parliament were upon them, and that it was intended to follow this up, by a series of measures for reforming the minor courts of justice in that country. He concluded by moving, "That leave be given to bring in a Bill for the easier and better Administration of Justice in the Court of Chancery in Ireland."

Mr. Martin, of Galway, seconded the motion, though he would have preferred adopting the plan recommended by the commissioners.

The Earl of Carhampton disapproved of the principle adopted with regard to compensation.

Sir J. Newport felt happy in being able to say that the commission appointed to inquire into courts of justice, had been productive of the most beneficial effects. The labours of the Irish commissioners had indeed been productive of the most valuable results to the public. They had had to contend with every thing which official prejudice could suggest to

thwart them, and every thing which interest could put in practice against them. It might be instructive to look at the different manners in which the inquiry was conducted in the three kingdoms. The address which he moved, was carried by one vote on the 28th June 1814, and the commissioners were appointed in March 1815; and he was sorry to say that two masters in chancery were appointed among the English commissioners for inquiry into abuses, many of which were alleged to exist in the offices of the masters in chancery. Six valuable reports had been received from the Irish commissioners, and the results which were of the utmost importance to all who had at heart the due administration of justice, were in possession of every member of the House. The Scotch commissioners had given in five reports, containing in many parts very useful suggestions, and why these suggestions had not been proceeded on, it remained for his majesty's ministers to account to the House. From the English commissioners, however, two reports had only been received in five years. The right hon. baronet proceeded to detail some of the reductions of expense which had been effected, and complained of the unjust principle on which the allowances to the different officers had heen augmented, in consequence of which the Six Clerks, who, in England, had not more than 3004. per annum each, derived in Ireland from 400l. to upwards of 1,100l. per annum. It was evident, that if this inquiry had not been gone into, the doors of justice would have been shut to a great part of the public. He congratulated himself therefore on having brought forward this subject, and he had to thank the House for the support which they gave him. To show the enormous nature of the fees in the court of chancery, he might mention that in one case the fees for docketing, enrolling, exemplifying, and registering a decree, amounted to upwards of 800%. If compensation was afforded at all to the various officers, it ought only to be for fees established by such a length of prac tice, as to remove all suspicion of the party receiving the compensation being himself accessory to any addition to the fees, officers ought not to derive advantage from their own misinterpretation of statutes to the injury of the public.

Mr. Leslie Foster, as one of the Irish commissioners, entered into a statement of several of the reforms recommended by

them. By the present bill, nearly one-half of the time and money formerly spent by suitors in the court of chancery would be saved. With respect to compensation to the various officers, he had to observe, that many of the officers of the Irish court of chancery were purchasers of their offices under existing laws for valuable considerations, and if any thing ought to be the subject of compensation, it struck him that these offices ought. Scarcely any difference of opinion had existed between the commissioners and the lord chancellor, except on one subject. The commissioners recommended two additional masters in chancery for the business of taxation alone, on the general principle, that officers connected with the business of the court ought to have nothing to do with the taxation. The lord chancellor, however, conceived that taxation might be more beneficially entrusted to an officer previously acquainted with the history of the cause. He still retained his former opinion, but he bowed to superior authority; and he hoped the House would be disposed to receive the benefit as it was, standing as it did, on the recommendation of the lord chancellor and the commissioners, and would not endeavour to enter into the details of the business, with which they could not grapple. The present bill would effect a greater improvement in the court of chancery in Ireland than had ever, he believed, been effected at one in any court of justice.

. Mr. Valentine Blake thought the remedy proposed worse than the disease. Vested rights were those of all others which that House protected. He was fearful that sufficient time would not be afforded for the consideration of the measure in question; and as to the report alluded to, what it principally recommended was, the assimilation of the proceedings in the Irish court of Chancery to those of the English Chancery court.

Mr. V. Fitzgerald said, in despite of the gloomy anticipations of the hon. gentleman, he hoped the House would not postpone the bill. Were they to understand, that the lord chancellor and master of the rolls in Ireland wished the bill to be postponed? This bill came before the House with their recommendation, and it was known that they were anxious the bill should now be proceeded in.

Leave was given to bring in the bill. CHARGE AGAINST Baron M'LELLAN (VOL. XL.)

FOR BREACH OF JUDICIAL DUTY.] Mr. Martin, of Galway, said, that in rising to bring forward a substantive charge against a judge, he was well aware of the difficult task he had undertaken. He was sensible, that the House should visit in the severest manner any man who should be daring or wicked enough to bring forward any unfounded charge or calumny against a judge. From the first moment he had heard that all the allegations which he had brought before the House had been flatly traversed by the learned judge whom they regarded, he had treated that contradiction with all the deference due to assertions coming from such a quarter. But he was now determined to prove his own truth and integrity in making those charges; all of which he had reduced to a written one. What would be said of a naval officer who should bring forward an unfounded accusation against a military one; or of a military officer who should act so in regard to his superior? Why, he believed that the court-martial, whether naval or military, would dismiss the person making such false charge. What would be the House's opinion of him, himself, for he would not shrink from saying so, should he adduce false charges and groundless calumnies against the learned judge? They ought to expel him from their assembly; but what would they say when he told them that he had in the gallery seven or eight witnesses, who were ready not merely to substantiate his averments, but to prove them to be altogether true ? which he had to make against the learned judge was, that he had thought proper to send an armed body of men into the court, by whom all were cleared out of it, with the exception of one hon. gentleman (Mr. V. Blake) who, by some stratagem or other, had the good fortune to hide himself under one of the benches. Not contented with this most unusual and unjustifiable proceeding, he placed sentinels at all the avenues to prevent access to the court. Was this, he asked, conduct to be tolerated in a judge whose bounden duty it was to administer justice with impartiality? But this was not all. A jury which was, at the time when his (Mr. Martin's) trial came on, deliberating upon its verdict in a previous case, was not allowed to deliver that verdict until his cause was decided. The jury was not allowed admittance into the court; and in answer to the second application made (31)

The first charge

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convinced that the learned judge whose conduct had been thus arraigned was wholly incapable of prostituting the high power with which he had been vested, to answer any private end which he might be supposed to have in view; and he confessed that he saw nothing in the statement which had been made, which could in any manner justify this serious charge against the learned judge. The real question to be considered was, whether there was any rational ground to impute such corruption to baron McLellan as to justify the inquiry? And first, he wished the House to recollect, that five years had been suffered to elapse before any steps were taken in parliament upon this subject; and although at that time the country had not the benefit of Mr. Martin's talents as a representative, yet as an individual he might have laid his case before the legislature. With respect to the interference of the military, he was fully aware that it was not customary in this country to introduce soldiers into courts of justice; but in Ireland the practice was totally different, and troops were frequently called in for the preservation of order. With respect to this individual instance, he certainly was not acquainted with the particular circumstances under which the learned judge had thought proper to call in the military; but this did not alter the view he had taken of the case, for it still resolved itself into a question of practice only, with which this House ought not to interfere. The hon.

for that purpose, M. Baron M'Lellan told the gentlemen, that he would not allow them to be liberated until his (Mr. M.'s) case was decided. He added, "If you knock again, I will commit you." making this charge against the learned judge, he begged to disclaim all feelings of animosity towards that individual. But it had been said, that this was a motion which was trifling, unfounded, out of time, an attempt to throw obloquy and reproach upon a respectable character, and an unworthy attack upon an excellent judge. In answer to all this he had only to say, that he was most confident that every syllable he had uttered was true. As a friend to the learned judge, he should recommend a strict inquiry; and, as far as respected himself, he was most anxious that an investigation should be made into the whole transaction. The ground upon which the learned judge had refused to postpone the trial was, that there was not a sufficient affidavit produced. But what could have been more satisfactory than the affidavit of Dr. Crampton, the professional gentleman who attended his principal witness, Mr. Coneys, in his illness, and who swore that Mr. Coneys was unable to attend in consequence of severe indisposition? This affidavit was actually sworn, and given to the proper officer of the court. But even supposing that this affidavit had not been made, he was prepared to contend, that the affidavit of a medical gentleman was not necessary upon such an occasion. There was, however, one fact which ren-member had wished to advocate his own dered the conduct of the learned judge inexcusable, namely, that he had access to the information upon which the indictment was founded, and from that document Mr. Baron M'Lellan must have known that the evidence of Mr. Coneys was of the utmost consequence. After some further remarks, he concluded by submitting a charge drawn up in form against the Hon. James M'Lellan, and moving, that this House will resolve itself into a committee of the whole House, to take the said Article of Charge into consideration, upon this day fortnight."

cause, and to examine his own witnesses; but this, it appeared, was in direct violation of all the rules of practice; and however competent the hon. member might be, and he had no doubt from the proof of his great abilities in this House, that he was most competent to conduct his own cause, yet, as it was against all practice, it was most proper that he should have been interrupted in that proceeding. The hon. member was certainly competent to lay the charge upon the table, but he should advise him to withdraw the complaint altogether. If the object of the hon. member was, to exculpate himself in some measure, he could assure him (and in

Lord Castlereagh objected to the motion, principally on the ground that the House had no right to interfere in a ques-saying so he was sure he spoke the sentition of pure practice in the court in which Baron McLellan presided. In considering this question, he was actuated by no feelings but those which belonged to the justness of the case; but he felt quite

ments of the House), that, as far as the hon. member was concerned, there was not the slightest occasion for the proceeding, as the hon. member had not subjected himself to the animadversions or imputa

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